Another league with a significant drop from steam/tourist retention.

I share this with the community because this is not the second or third month into a four month league cycle, but we're still into the first. Today is April the 2nd while Mirage launched March the 6th steam numbers of around 50k concurrent players from 157k into the second (not first) week, which means over two thirds of steam users (tourists) have stopped playing.

Retention is what sells supporter packs not league launches. When these "tourists" are gone it means they're elsewhere, which means whatever else they're playing/supporting is equal or better (free or not to play).

What we do know based on this data is that the current league design formula is not good enough for the majority of steam users/tourists, but will it be enough for GGG to keep doing the same or will have to re-examine both the core game and league concept design?


There's two questions.

1) Will the current employees at GGG eventually be able to design the type of ARPG that retains at least half of these tourists through half of the league cycles or will they eventually lose the other 33% from a better competition?

2) When your retention ends, why and at what threshold your retention needs to be before you'll purchase a league supporter pack?


Mirage for me has been a solid league when I compare it with the last few. Since I'm exclusively a SSF hardcore player I play the game solely to compete with / against the community and that means it has to have a lucrative ladder/ranking system (currently most don't know or care who are the top ranked for good reason).

Less overpowered builds that carry the masses and the league to introduce challenging experience that's fun solving/overcoming faster/better from the rest. That being said my retention would've ended around the third week, but thanks to the Gauntlet event it will be extended to around the middle of April and that means another competitive event, perhaps similar to Phrecia needs to happen to see myself playing for two out of four months, which is the minimum to purchase a $30 supporter pack and the next will be $60 if back to back leagues my retention is over two months.

Again; a drop-off isn't necessarily negative. SEVERAL prominent players, as well as guild members and friends, have "all" placed Mirage in their top five leagues of all time, but have moved on to either the new LE season or other things.

People play intensively for a few weeks then feel fulfilled. That's not necessarily a negative thing, but does maybe increase the chances of them being back next league. I think players taking breaks is good for them AND the game in the long run. I don't even think their goal is or should be to keep us here for several month - between PoE1 and PoE2. A player burning out on either game will hurt both of them.

That said; the game is in an easy state and rewarding state, which means a lot of players will feel "done" faster. I'm sure once we get a league where they add more grind and/or new difficult bosses - or a league mechanic with its own endgame grind will help retention.

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Kopogero#0635 wrote:

I share this with the community because this is not the second or third month into a four month league cycle, but we're still into the first.

I’ll take the bait, but let’s at least dress it up properly.

We’re one month into the league now, and the pattern couldn’t be more predictable. The surge has passed, the numbers have settled, and the reality is that most players are already done two to three weeks in. They come in, go hard, extract their enjoyment at full speed, and then step away until the next reset. That’s not a design flaw, it’s one entirely valid way to engage with PoE.

At the same time, there’s another group of players who stick around longer, driven by different goals, whether that’s min-maxing, planning and developing multiple characters, or simply embracing a slower, more methodical pace. That approach is just as valid, just a different way to experience the league.

So what exactly is the point being made here? That player numbers drop off? Of course they do, they always have, and they always will.
That the game isn’t built around sustaining the same level of engagement for an entire league cycle? That’s been evident and known for years.

Or is this less about the numbers and more of a subtle message, a reminder that, despite a fresh start a month ago, Kopogero is nowhere to be found on the leaderboards? No presence, no push, no sign and no commitment when it actually counts.

If this post had shown up yesterday, it might have earned a smile worth April Fool’s, but since it’s a day late, it’s more concerning to see player retention being misrepresented, misused, or even twisted into false claims.

The league was great and everyone liked it. Asynch trade will make every league shorter. That's just the way it goes and it's not a bad thing. Enjoy your free time playing other games.

good stats, everything according to plan. game is alive and well

You said "tourist" and yet you don't even know how the cycle has been since temporary league become the focus. It was always 1 month, every.single.time.

New league and new support pack dropped
> People like/hate the league
> They play for 1 month and buy Support Pack / They don't play and wait for next
> The first and second week will be the most bustling (Third and fourth, or even after a month will be still bustling if there are things that are just that good)
> Players count dropped steadily at 1-month mark

That usually what happened but there are slight changes with the recent async trade implementation. Players can just buy items from faustus, regardless online-presence.

There are less incentives to be super active in early league, selling stuffs and snowballing resources, or keep playing the game / be in the game just to sell stuffs or trying to buy something before the seller goes offline until next league.

The game wasn't designed with the intent to inflate retention numbers, it was designed to capture people attention when the league released and relying on supporter pack sales on those days. Watch Chris Wilson's presentation in GDC on youtube where he explained how PoE works.

Lmao imagine thinking retention sells packs not league launches.

There is a reason we are up to 6 leagues a year fundamentally. Retention is important as a metric for how much staying power a leagues mechanics had in relation to their likely inclusion but aside from that it'd be better for GGG if everyone quit after 2 weeks as long as they came back for the first 2 weeks next time.

Ohh boi I hate the premise of "you can't retain people for half a league, so it sucks/your competition is better".

No. Period!

- PoE is not loosing me to any competition NOR do I think the game sucks.
- Yet I only play 2-3 weeks every league.
- Lots of us do.
- It's fits our pattern (vacation, work, social life, in-game aspirations etc. etc.)

Retention beyond week x is not a yardstick for the success.
Money is!

If those of us that play hard but short pay more money than those who chill and stick around longer, then an attempt to force retention beyond a certain point can even hurt GGG. When do people like OP learn this?

Some people just like to play more than 1 game. Why are you so worried about retention?

I mean this is arpg and this is why everyone normal wants faster seasons, 3 weeks is ideal if you have 1h per day to finish 40/40, pump some currency and move on to another games, especially that now you have your mageblood in maybe 4 days if you have hands and you are able to click on mirage ;D