Missing Flat Defense Bench Crafts

+17-22 to Max Energy Shield, +50-75 to Evasion Rating or Armour.

Life has two tiers of crafted flat items that are better than these: 26-40 at Level 32 and 56-70 at Level 60.

It feels like an arbitrary limit, making it even harder to craft these items that are already difficult to craft with two prefixes.

Is this the intended design? It feels like an oversight to me rather than an intentional decision.

you are not considering the fact that there are far more combo % mods associated with those defenses that multiply those numbers.....more than life % mods which are only influenced mods and single tier (im pretty sure? didn't look it up).

You take those defenses and combine them with 100%+ increased defenses in mods and the numbers make a lot more sense in terms of balance.

It's also different in that those mods are local, and therefore have a different "value" depending on the item base they are crafted onto...whereas life mods are global and have a static value entirely dependent on your passive tree instead.



Consider the fact that its generally hard to push your life beyond 6 or 7k even with heavy investment (non-specialized)....yet ES and armour/eva numbers are commonly in the 10s of thousands or hundreds of thousands.

There aren't people with hundreds of thousands of ES.

Of the 124510 Mirage characters on poe.ninja's index, there are 5379 people with more than 10k ES, that's 4%.

There are 214 people with ES above 20K.

Comparatively, there are 18704 characters above 6K life, that's 15%.

It's also not affecting these 10k+ ES characters who have end game and mirrored gear, the biggest characters affected by low tier bench crafts are people early in their progression and on league start.

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livejamie#0512 wrote:

There aren't people with hundreds of thousands of ES.

hundreds of thousands eva / armor, not ES. You had all three in your OP, so I mentioned all three in my response.

ES is 10s, the others are way higher for sure.


But I notice that you nitpicked that instead of all the rest of what I wrote? You can't look at the mod in isolation and expect to get the whole picture. Nothing in the game works like that.


At the same level you have the 26-40 life crafting mod....you ALSO have access to the defense mod, which then gets further amplified by the other mods on the item itself......something that CAN'T happen to the benchcrafted life mod.

Let's take your ES benchcraft as a direct example: the value completely in isolation may be 17 - 22, but then you pair that with 75%+ increased ES on the item available at the same time and....those numbers are functionally even or higher than the life benchcraft value. That's the point.



People early in their progression get PLENTY of ES and eva/arm as compared to life...they are so much easier to come by and stack up. They are not at all struggling because the isolated numerical values of the hybrid benchcrafts don't directly line up.



***Also....there are 3 tiers of flat defense mods, compared to the 2 tiers of life mods. And your numbers are incorrect: if we look at pure es benchcraft...the value goes up to a maximum of 69 energy shield. Even in isolation, its more than the life benchcraft. The maximum value changes based on the gear spot because, as I mentioned, unlike flat life...flat defenses have far more scaling mods. Even the lowest possible value can scale to a higher flat value than life on that same piece of gear. In this respect, your attempt to compare a hybrid mod to a mono mod is like comparing apples to oranges.

I also just realized that flat ES has such a bad craft the other day. Ended up just crafting for a little extra damage.



% ES isnt as punishing, just roll for flat ES naturally and benchcraft the %ES.

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cowmoo275#3095 wrote:

At the same level you have the 26-40 life crafting mod....you ALSO have access to the defense mod, which then gets further amplified by the other mods on the item itself......something that CAN'T happen to the benchcrafted life mod.

Let's take your ES benchcraft as a direct example: the value completely in isolation may be 17 - 22, but then you pair that with 75%+ increased ES on the item available at the same time and....those numbers are functionally even or higher than the life benchcraft value. That's the point.



People early in their progression get PLENTY of ES and eva/arm as compared to life...they are so much easier to come by and stack up. They are not at all struggling because the isolated numerical values of the hybrid benchcrafts don't directly line up.



***Also....there are 3 tiers of flat defense mods, compared to the 2 tiers of life mods. And your numbers are incorrect: if we look at pure es benchcraft...the value goes up to a maximum of 69 energy shield. Even in isolation, its more than the life benchcraft. The maximum value changes based on the gear spot because, as I mentioned, unlike flat life...flat defenses have far more scaling mods. Even the lowest possible value can scale to a higher flat value than life on that same piece of gear. In this respect, your attempt to compare a hybrid mod to a mono mod is like comparing apples to oranges.

You can augment benchcrafted life with a hybrid defence/life mod to easily get ~100 flat life on a piece.

I strongly disagree that you can get away with using +17 to +22 flat ES benchcrafted on a piece of gear.

A 20% pair of Warlock Gloves with T1 Increased ES and T1 hybrid is 241 ES and it goes to 305 with the +22 bench craft.

(This is also a best-case scenario; getting 2X T1 is hard)

A 20% of Leviathan Gauntlets with T1 Hybrid goes from 28 Life to 98 Life with the +70 Bench Craft.

That's a difference of 26% increased to 250% increased. You also have to get two already existing mods, and you lose out on a mod already if you want movespeed on boots or any of the good prefixes on gloves (damage while leeching, etc)

I also disagree with people getting "plenty of ES" compared to life early in progression. If you look at the first few days of Mirage league, there are very few people invested in ES. It's common for people to be life-based until they can afford to switch.

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livejamie#0512 wrote:

I also disagree with people getting "plenty of ES" compared to life early in progression. If you look at the first few days of Mirage league, there are very few people invested in ES. It's common for people to be life-based until they can afford to switch.

No......they don't "switch" at all. ES numbers are ALWAYS higher than life numbers throughout the early game. The problem is it doesn't serve as a comparable defensive layer on its own until much later.

Before...you were isolating when you shouldn't have, and now you are conflating unrelated things.


If you are talking about numbers, which your entire post is about, you need only look at the very first post I wrote: numbers for max ES, Evasion, and Armour on builds which use them are SIGNIFICANTLY higher than those for life.

Maybe life is better for mid-game or early game.....that isn't really anything new. Evasion is ALSO better than armour for early and mid game....so what?

It's also true that some benchcrafts are better than others, period. And some are more useful on different pieces of gear (like the higher max es roll on a shield). And some are more useful at different stages of the game, or unused in endgame items.